If the government shuts down in a few days, how much longer will our pending transfers be delayed?
10 months is unacceptable. Absolute bulldookie.
If the government shuts down in a few days, how much longer will our pending transfers be delayed?
10 months is unacceptable. Absolute bulldookie.
Good question. I doubt we would be this lucky, but I heard on the NRA-ILA that the NICS system will still be up if the government shuts down. I wonder if the NFA branch is same.
As for 10 months, that is from the date it goes pending. It took them 2 months from the check being cashed to go pending, so 1 year is the wait time.
Something has to be done. There is no reason a NICS background check for an AR15 w/ a 16 inch barrel takes seconds and one for a 14.5 inch barrel takes a year.
What frustrates me the most is I am paying them a $200 tax for an ever slowing down service.
Last edited by jason8844; 09-28-2013 at 07:55 PM.
It's not a NICS check. That is a fairly common misconception. NICS is but one database and an NFA check utilizes at least 5 via FBI. And about that $200... You are paying the same amount that was levied at the start of the NFA. It has never been adjusted over time. And there are orders of magnitude more folks applying for transfer. So in real terms, you are paying less for a service that ever more people want.
As for NFA Examiners, since the contractors and most of the folks at NFA branch did receive furlough instructions in previous shut down escapades, I can only assume that the same will hold true this time, if it happens. I expect even more slow downs everywhere if the budget crashes.
Jeff Folloder
NFATCA Executive Director
www.nfatca.org
Your post reminds me of a quote by one of my conservative heroes of the 18th century, Edmund Burke. He stated "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."Originally Posted by ExecDirector
While I have no doubt your intentions are good, you seem to be one of too many NFA collectors that simply shrugs off the wait and thinks "Well, that is just the way it is." You seem to be defending the actions of the NFA Branch in this endeavor. While I agree with your historical facts about the $200 tax, let's not forget the whole purpose of that tax was to discourage citizens from even applying. Now that insidious misappropriation of government power has been supplanted by the CLEO sign off and the ever growing wait. As long as no one raises their voices, the people in charge realize that they have used deception to get you to believe that it is the new norm. They will keep adding to the wait until they encounter more resistance. By then it is too late, and once again the anti-gunners have advanced the ball down the proverbial gridiron. All we can do is accept this new paradigm. When will enough be enough? To many people in the NFA world are not speaking up and doing nothing as to not "rock the boat." This lack of action is what Edmund Burke was talking about in regards to letting evil win.
Every year our national budget grows, even with sequestration. Every year the redundant and every bloating government bureaucracies gain more staff, bigger budgets and more encroaching power.
Q: When the IRS has more returns to go through, what do they do? A: They hire more staff.
Q: When the DOJ has a bigger case load to go through, what do they do? A: They hire more staff.
Q: When the EPA has a rise in applications for drilling permits, what do they do? A: They hire more staff.
Q: When the DHS has a rise in applications for more immigration, what do they do? They hire more staff.
But then...
Q: When the NFA Branch has more applications to process, what do they do? A: They REDUCE staff, furlough workers, and add more burdensome steps to the application process.
One of these is not the like the others. Can you tell which?
Something is very wrong with this picture.
We would not accept unreasonable wait times for tax returns, marriage licenses, drivers licenses, SSI benefits, etc. For Pete's sake, we put man on the moon and the best we can do is a year wait to get approval to knock five inches off of a rifle barrel? I am not an unreasonable man and believe there is some legitimacy in the NFA system. I personally do not feel burdened by the fingerprints, passport photos, or the transfer tax. I am even ok with filing out forms for interstate travel of my NFA weapons. I am a law abiding citizen and do not want prohibited persons obtaining such weapons. I believe however that with my concessions of natural, God-given rights there should be in return a "reasonable" processing time on my applications. Heck, I am not asking for a month or two months. I am fine with 4 or 5. But 10 months? A year? How long will it take before more people stand up and say enough is enough?
Maybe you already have all your NFA toys and the wait times no longer affect you in any substantial way. I could understand your sentiment if that was the case. However, as a representative of an organization that represents people like myself I am very disheartened by your lack of concern. Even after the NFACTA's recent debacle with the ATF, I still considered joining and donating money. I am a member of the NRA, ASA and GOA. However, I am just not convinced that your organization really represents me and my concerns with the current NFA system.
I am not blaming you or your organization. Nor do I blame the examiners or contract labor at the NFA Branch. Everyone is just doing what they are told and no one wants to ruffle anyone's feathers. While nothing is being said and nothing is being done, the anti-gunners are quietly advancing their agenda and bringing to a screeching halt the entire NFA system.
Last edited by jason8844; 09-29-2013 at 06:04 PM.
One of the problems is that the registry is filled with items that shouldn't even be regulated as NFA items in my opinion.
Why are suppressors, sawed off shotguns, short barreled rifles, and AOWs even on the NFA list? Because they are "more dangerous" than Title I firearms? Uhhhh...no. The deadliest mass shooting in the history of the United States was pulled off with a Glock 19 and a Walther P22 - weapons that can be obtained in the time that it takes to fill out a 4473 and produce a CWP and driver's license.
De-regulate these items and you would only be left with machine guns and destructive devices. Transferable machine guns are prohibitively expensive for most people and destructive devices are not all that common. Now, the wait time has been reduced to a reasonable period of time. Problem solved.
Other than people like us - the NFATCA has the most to lose in this fight. In the minds of many people, they are to blame for the recent ATF debacle. If things don't get straightened out, it is possible that NFATCA will go underwater. All that they have worked for will be for nothing. Therefore, this organization is going to fight like hell to keep that from happening. I became a financial supporter for this very reason even though I had reservations about doing so.Maybe you already have all your NFA toys and the wait times no longer affect you in any substantial way. I could understand your sentiment if that was the case. However, as a representative of an organization that represents people like myself I am very disheartened by your lack of concern. Even after the NFACTA's recent debacle with the ATF, I still considered joining and donating money. I am a member of the NRA, ASA and GOA. However, I am just not convinced that your organization really represents me and my concerns with the current NFA system.
Quite true. This is the time to remain united. We can express our displeasure after the situation has been diffused.I am not blaming you or your organization. Nor do I blame the examiners or contract labor at the NFA Branch. Everyone is just doing what they are told and no one wants to ruffle anyone's feathers. While nothing is being said and nothing is being done, the anti-gunners are quietly advancing their agenda and bringing to a screeching halt the entire NFA system.
I agree, but we have to fight this one battle at a time. Getting those things off the registry would be great, but not politically possible in the near future. Getting wait times down is. We need a well thought out and goal oriented approach to this whole mess. For example I think we need to focus on moving fight in our direction a little at a time. I think we should work for these things in this order...
1. Reduce wait times
2. Fight for CLEO signature elimination
3. Fight for SBRs, SBRs and Silencers to be removed from the registry
4. Repeal of the Hughes Amendment
5. Repeal the NFA
We can not go for all or broke. We have to fight this like the anti-gunners do. One piece at a time.
I concur with your sentiment here. However, I am really not sure what the NFACTA really wants. Have they ever published a political platform or agenda that outlines their goals? The NRA, GOA and ASA all have.
I hope to be able to detail the exact actions that the NFATCA will be bringing to bear in the next few days. In the mean time, please understand that my intent is not to be an apologist for ATF. Rather, I seek to bring facts to the discussion. A lot of folks make assumptions that do not hold up well when the light of scrutiny flips on. For instance, the NICS check thing.
Jeff Folloder
NFATCA Executive Director
www.nfatca.org
Approval for gun permits will be put on hold. That was announced. Here is the deal but you already probably know this: the current dicktatorship in control does not want firearms in US civilian hands. Plain and simple, of any kind. If you think anything else regardless of what they tell you, you are beyond help. The govt. with your tax dollars (including your $200) will arm drug cartels and terror cells but you my friend are not to be trusted with a bang stick. So in essence, yeah your application will be delayed. Jason you live in Texas and you may also already know this as well but us Texans got doubly screwed on NFA because Sara Jones the previous examiner for Texas has been promoted, and she was pretty quick and thorough. Her entire case load got transferred to some newbie and Texas now has the longest wait in the US. Coincidently, King barry/holder have a special disdain for Texas and the feeling is mutual so nothing surprises me from these commies anymore.
FYI removing 1-4 inches off a firearm makes it extremely dangerous, like bayonet lugs.
Last edited by ddnc; 10-01-2013 at 01:54 PM.
I am not surprised. As a conservative, I am glad the Republicans are holding their ground and the government shut down. What is another few weeks to my NFA applications? At this point, I am fine with it.
I am under no illusions and agree with you. They want what all authoritarians want... a monopoly on violence. After all, when they have all the guns, what are you going to do when they simply throw out the Constitution?
As for losing Sara Jones, I only recently heard this and Jason Bowers is our new examiner. I heard Sara was great and in fact was my examiner on my first couple of Form 4s.
Well, well! It seems ATF is really out to screw us now. Two of my stamps which were supposed to be approved last week and sent January 2013 will not be approved until sometime in the summer of 2014. Their stance is now 15 months from pending and all current pending/ 90 days until approval is a pile of dog sh**, as all current pendings have been invalidated. I anticipate them denying any current pending forms that are not Cleo sign offs and the 4, I E-formed 1 month ago which immediately went pending I honestly don't believe those will ever be approved, furthermore when the govt. shuts down in a couple months or so AGAIN, this BS. will all start over. Sorry, over 1 year to lick a frickin' stamp for which they cash over 1 year prior is totally unacceptable especially on multiple stamps on the same trust. SUCKO!
Last edited by ddnc; 10-24-2013 at 12:55 AM.
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